Podcast Transcript

Rob Birdsell: Hello, Kent. Welcome to The Next Class.

Kent Hickey: Hello, Rob. How are you doing?

Rob Birdsell: Good. This is a new format for us doing a little premeet, a little preview of the podcast.
Uh, how are things in Gig Harbor first, though?

Kent Hickey: Uh, they're just fine. Beautiful day here today and, actually it's good soccer weather as as I look out there right now. So...

Rob Birdsell: And we're going to get a lot of soccer coming up today. We also in Chicago... Last Thursday we hit 64 degrees at the beach. Not, at the beach. Met two guys down there, didn't think to bring my sunscreen. Got a little sunburned.

Kent Hickey: I noticed that, Rob. I didn't want to say.

Rob Birdsell: In February.

Kent Hickey: Yeah. It's I think it's called a windb burn, Rob, but that's okay.

Rob Birdsell: That could have been the walk this afternoon. We had the wind was blowing hard right before I came in here.

So Kent, today we have a really interesting guest.

Kent Hickey: Yeah.

Rob Birdsell: Fabrice Gautrat is the head coach of the women's professional soccer team in Houston, the Houston Dash. Interesting, he's married to Morgan Bryan, longtime US national team player for Orlando. Player and now playing in Europe in England, I believe. Fabrice coached my youngest daughter and, I was counting it up, when I was preparing for this. We had over 30 years of youth soccer coaching between our three kids. A lot of different coaches, and I could only think of two or three bad coaches. We had some really good coaches, but I will put Fabrice up in the top two. If not the top one.

Kent Hickey: Yeah, I'm looking forward to what he has to say about leadership qualities. And what I was thinking about actually when I was walking our dog this morning was, in here in the Seattle area. I think the three best coaches, that I got to know over the years: John Hamill, Peter Fuing, and Brian Schmezer. And Brian Schmezer is actually the coach of the Sounders, right? The men's team here. But I was really... When I was thinking about their leadership is that I don't I mean they must know a lot about soccer. They that's what they do in their lives. But I just was struck by they're just such good people. They're humble. They're thoughtful. They're humorous. But the key is they really care for kids. They meet kids where they're at. And I'm really looking forward to talking to Freeze because given what you said about him, my guess is that he's going to be someone who does that, right? That really is person centered, not results centered even though he lives very much in a results environment. Right. So, I'm looking forward to it.

Rob Birdsell: Good. Well, let's welcome Fabrice in here and we'll see you at the back of the show.

 

Rob Birdsell: Hello and welcome to The Next Class. I'm Rob Birdsell your host joined by one of my co-hosts Kent Hickey. Kent, good to see you.

Kent Hickey: Good to see you Rob. Hello.

Rob Birdsell: And we have a special guest, Fabrice Gautrat from the Houston Dash. Fabrice, welcome.

Fabrice Gautrat: Thank you, Rob. Appreciate you having me. Looking forward to diving into all things leadership.

Rob Birdsell: That's great. And for our listeners, Fabrice and I have known each other, I think Caroline and I just did the math, seven years, I believe. He was the coach of my daughter during an important period of her looking to play in college and really I feel helped her land in an amazing spot. So a lot of time traveling with Fabrice all around the country.

But, Fabrice, let's jump into this here. In researching this I learned stuff about you that I didn't know, that I believe your father is French and your mother is Brazilian.

Fabrice Gautrat: Mhm.

Rob Birdsell: Which again, having known you for seven years I didn't know that you you'd think with your name I kind of figured the French piece out. But, how did how did their backgrounds influence not only your soccer, but more importantly what you're doing now you're coaching your leadership.

Fabrice Gautrat: Yeah, so, they met and had me in Southern California. So another small melting pot. And so I grew up playing on a lot of Hispanic teams too. And I remember early on, my mom worked for an airline company Brazil. So she would send me to Brazil like by myself at like five six years old. So like from an early age or France like she'd be like hey you're going off for like a month. So, from an early age I just learned to just connect with people from very different cultures. So, I think the mix of them but also my upbringing. I think also being an only child, I was always pushed to be around other people, you know, like because you're, you know, you're by yourself, so you like whether it's neighborhood kids or, you know, going with family in Brazil or France. So, yeah, from a young age, just connecting with people was just part of my DNA. So...

Kent Hickey: Did you talk about your soccer career a little bit before coaching, but did you play with that Brazilian flare? Did you have that going for you there? With your ball, you know, like are you a magician? Are you magician with the ball?

Fabrice Gautrat: No, no, no. I was a center back, left back. I could play out for sure. I wasn't as athletic as probably you needed to be. I try to use my brains and disguise and deception and those type of things. I wouldn't say I was this creative flare, you know, number 10 or forward, but I did okay.
I did okay in center back for sure.

Kent Hickey: I'm sure you did more than okay. I have on my wall, by the way, a number 10. There's ple up on my wall. One of my first books I read was, I think it was my life in the beautiful game. You know, ple there and his co in his cosmos gear and your cosmos. Dating myself a little bit there, Rob.

Rob Birdsell: So, moving to leadership Fabrice, you've as we talked a little bit about you've coached at every level. I mean here in Chicago at FC United at at one of academies, you've coached at  prep schools, at professional clubs, now at the Houston Dash... What what is something that goes through all those different ages? I mean that's... I mean you're talking I think you were down age 13-14 to you know multi-year vets. What is a through line that that leaders can think about when they think about multiple ages leading

Fabrice Gautrat: Yeah, I would say first and foremost wherever you are, add value and I would say more importantly add outrageous value. And so regardless so I've been an assistant, I've been a director, I've been a head coach, you know, youth co like whatever you want to call it. And I think that's the first piece. The second piece is try to create an unparalleled environment. I remember even at FC United, it's like okay, you know, we had the new incoming of the DA. You also had threats of other clubs. You had all these things around. And I felt for me it's like, okay, we need to create an unparalleled environment. Yes, they feel cared for, but also they feel they're in an environment where they're being challenged and they're being supported. And so, meeting those people where they're at. To your point, I remember a year Georgia Rush, I'm coaching U8s, U11s, U14s, U18s all in the same year. And so, like who you have to be and how you have to meet the different age groups where they're at is like really, really important. So, yeah, I would say add outrageous value. I think that would be the number one thing. And then meet people where they're at. In terms of that part.

Rob Birdsell: I like that outrageous value.

Kent Hickey: Well, I wrote down outrageous value and you also said unparalleled environment. What do you... Could you expand on that a little bit? What do you what what for you would be an unparalleled environment? You know? That for you know the coaching whether it's the you know the level you're doing now right head of a professional program which is amazing but also kind of those lower age groups that you talked about meeting them where they're at. So what does an unparalleled environment look like?

Fabrice Gautrat: So I I'll start even you know in the FC United days because it's pertinent to this combo. You know, we we were fortunate where we had facilities and infrastructure. So, it wasn't just like, oh, what for Breeze wants. We had, you know, we had this little indoor space with video room. And so, for me, obviously, I'm like, how do we create this this environment where they feel like they're getting better, a professional environment, right? So, a little bit of video. I think also, you know, you always had the the lure of high school season, right? Like leaving to go potentially go high school or leave to go to another club. And I felt like when I say unparalleled environment, I want what we have. Like when they come into training, it's so much different and it's so I don't want to sound arrogant, but like it's so far superior than anything they can experience anywhere else that it's not even a conversation whether they should come and play for us. And so that's what I mean by that in all humility. That was always in the mindset like how do we create and that was you have to bring your passion every day. You have to bring you can't just like rah rah as well like you have to give real detail and insight to these players and back to the point of adding value like you need to add the top player value right you need to add you know the lower player value and so I think doing that now fast forward to where I'm at now it's the same thing like when I run a passing pattern or when a head you know assistant coach runs like I want it to be the best passing pattern that they've ever experienced right or if we're doing a small side game it's the same thing like every session is so important for us to develop all of our players. And so, yeah, that's it's it's a it's the same thing here. I want us to create an environment where we talk about a destination of choice that only becomes prevalent if what you create here is hopefully, and I'm not saying it is, but at least the idea behind it is far superior what they can experience anywhere else.

Kent Hickey: Rob, just jumping real quick just because something that Fris mentioned, I'm thinking about Catholic schools right now, is he's talking, you know, program of attraction, right? program attraction, not getting so hung up on what others are doing, looking at our best selves, right? Be better. And then we took it sometimes enrollment at Catholic schools, it kind of is what it is. You know, numbers have gone down, whatever it might be. But always one thing you can always try is well get better, you know, like be that program that is unparalleled in some way and really strive, right? And I assume that people were attracted to your program Fabrice, because they knew that well this I'm not going to waste my time. We're going to be doing meaningful meaningful drills here and and the team environment right does that seems that way to me that that's a great lesson for Catholic school leaders as well.

Rob Birdsell: Fabrice, on that, you're in your second year at Houston. Took over a, you know, a program that was, not at the top of its play. I think they may have been near the bottom. How do you... That culture coming in is not what we were just talking about. A lot of our school leaders, same thing. they go into a school and it's there's a reason there's a new president. Can you talk about changing culture? What you're doing in Houston? I mean, you finished the season just about in the playoffs, which is remarkable when where it was when you took over. I think you're doubled your second half points from the time you took over. So, what did you do in the middle of the season? You didn't get a whole preseason. You didn't get a build. Like, you took over a program. What did you do to change that from the little bit of research I did?

Fabrice Gautrat: Yeah, I mean, so I did start the beginning of the season last year with the group and so obviously we had kind of a slow start. We had to tweak through some things. We had a big midyear review where I just looked a lot internally and just like, okay, how do I need to grow and learn through that process and so it's yeah, it's taken a lot of time, but I would just say the first piece is without vision, the people will perish. And so what I mean by that is you have to have real clarity in terms of your vision in terms of and not only that is you need to also how do you bring in key stakeholders along the road of that vision because if you just say hey here's the vision walk in it and buy into it like that's not going to work either.
So you have to have clarity and vision and the more you can make not only make people but actually bring people within that vision the more I I don't like to use the word buy in but the more invested your stakeholders around you will be and the other piece is you know internal leadership you know I think as I grew in how I led the leaders within the team, that greatly improved the overall investment from the group and the players as a whole.
So, those are a few key lessons. I feel and obviously you know your football has to be clear, your ideas have to be clear, all those things true, but I think holistically that would I would say those two things are are for sure most important.

Kent Hickey: Wow. Yeah. Well, that again a lot of parallels here for leadership in in schools as well. Well, I'm going to cycle back to one of the first comments though you just made for Breeze is that I'm struck by your comment that when mid-season things weren't maybe going as well as you'd hoped, right? I mean, and but you use that for time to step back and reflect upon yourself, right? To say what what could I be doing differently? Could you describe what because that takes courage to do, right? I mean to hold that mirror up to self because a lot of like quite frankly a lot of times people are going to be pointing toward other things right if only we had this if only we had that but you great sign I think of a great leader is you said now I'm going to look at myself a little bit what was that experience like for you.

Fabrice Gautrat: Yeah I mean a big guiding truth or value in my life is extreme ownership like, if anything goes wrong like it's on me first and foremost it's not anyone else and so that's always been my mentality wherever I've been. And so through that we did we did one I did an internal audit of myself because I knew I needed to grow and be better. The other piece I did one of our current programs. So we looked at performance, culture, processes. Those are like the big three that we looked at and internally we're like and I brought the staff in. I was like hey how can we improve here? Where are we at here? Like pretty much a SWAT analysis on all those things. And so you know one of the things I learned to grow in, is, in the beginning I was very much it has to be this way and it has to be done at this manner and I felt like as I understood my group more the players I felt were too concerned with the rightness of it and so they would then become slightly more passive in execution and we all know when you're hesitating in terms of, you know, how to execute and you're not trusting your instincts, you're not going to perform at your highest level. So, I had to change a little bit, not necessarily the ideas, but how I communicate, you know, and so I think, you know, one of the big themes we talk about is aggressive mistakes. And so, that's something that I felt like just encourage them. Hey, go be yourself, go take ownership, like go make aggressive mistakes. And so I just had to change a little bit of the delivery and the overall message and create more of a we versus like me versus them. And that look that takes time like I have to grow and I don't know what I don't know. And I had to have a lot of hard conversations with people and get some good feedback. And that's kind of how all that um emerged for sure.

Rob Birdsell: You know, it's interesting Fabrice... I remember talking to a dad of a daughter who you coached for a number of years who I still remember him being he had not seen a coach so open to growth. You know, a lot of the coaches club coache kind of this is the way it's going to be and he was like kind of blown away at at what you're talking about that openness to your growth. So I'd say, as long as I've known you that's been a part of who you are is is that open like you're eating stuff up. Continuing on the leadership, do you have a leadership philosophy?

Fabrice Gautrat: Oh, yeah. I mean the first piece I kind of mentioned a little bit in terms of the vision, you have to have clarity of your vision.
Like that has to be really, just crystal clear. So like even, you know, going into this off season, one of my big visions or works was how do I become an expert in leading high performing women? Like that was something that for me, you know, when you're in the youth setting, you actually interact more with parents sometimes than the players because the players are there for such a small time, right? Like you interact a little bit, but it's more, you know, you're not really with them day in and day out, right? Outside of maybe the trips and things like that. And so then when you're an assistant, you're always the good guy, you know, like you're you're helping them. There's no pressure. You're not making hard decisions. like but now when you know you're in the the hot seat and you're you know making all these decisions you're not always going to be everyone's best friend you know and so for me really that was a big clarity moment for me I'm like I need to become more of an expert like how do I lead high performing women so whether it's you know reading Emma Hayes's books in Doranc's you know speaking with you know people like Mark Cororan or reading Don Staley like those are all things you know I just actually finished a book how to win which was phenomenal, by the psych performance psychologist from the England lionesses who won the Euros and that was like mind-blowing. So just, yeah I think first and foremost is leadership philosophy is vision involving stakeholders making them feel invested. So you have to take time, you have to ask questions, you have to and it's actually through that interaction and collection of information then you have to be very good at like deducting and actually analyzing the things in the direction that you need to go in you know. So I I think those are a few things that you know need to have and then the other piece is you need to have the daily discipline to execute like you
can have the greatest vision in the world if you don't have daily discipline. So I live a very disciplined life and so that that to me allows I feel to to execute, and the last piece I have to remind myself more and more and more but sometimes I get too task oriented and I have to remember this is a people business and so I have to put blocks in me and just like hey like why am I here? What's a gratitude practice or you know, being excited or passionate about helping people grow not so much getting the task done. So that's just a personal work for me that I constantly want to evolve. But those are a few things in terms of leadership of how I approach leadership um where I'm at.

Rob Birdsell: That's great. We're going to take a brief pause to get a word in from our sponsor.

 

SPONSOR BREAK

Kent Hickey: We're back from hearing from our sponsor and we're having a really wonderful interview and Rob, probably you feel the same way I do is just these lessons that Fris is talking about in terms of his leadership approach definitely applies to leadership in our schools. Before I break, one of the things that you mentioned, Fabrice, was that, you know, you're in a people business and earlier in our interview, I heard you say that you you really need to meet players where they were at, right? I mean, there was that going on, too. Quick aside, and leads to a question about meeting players where they're at. When I was at Seattle Prep, we had a wonderful  player, her name is Sam Hyatt, Samantha Hayyatt. Who was on the US national team and I think she plays for Portland now. I'm not... I think you know who she is, but anyway. Wonderful young woman and so I don't even know how this started, but I think it was her freshman year she had walked by my window and I had an old rotten pumpkin in the window. It was a little after Halloween, and for some reason, I think it was her idea, it must not have been mine, that we decided we're going to go up to the fourth floor of this building and throw the pumpkin out the window, you know, to smash the pumpkin. And so we did that every year, all four years, Sam would come to my office because I I always have a rotten pumpkin there. And there's such something so much fun about throwing pumpkins out a window and just watching them smash. And I don't want to read too much into this, but I'm kind of... Always was struck by the fact that here's a... I think she was on the, you know, the women's national or the national team at the time and such. And this this kid probably had so much pressure in her lives, to do well. Great parents, so I'm not saying it came from them, that she probably needed to smash pumpkins every once in a while. And I'm just wondering in terms of your coaching with your players, how do you weave into it? I'll call it mental health. I'll call it just joy. And and maybe it means sacrificing a certain drill at a certain time in order to have some of those moments. What are your what are your smashing pumpkin moments?

Fabrice Gautrat: Yeah, good question. This actually came or birthed out of that midyear review, but just kind of bringing more fun and more connection piece. So, we had we had something we did last year called three-minute throwback. So, we just had, you know, it started with myself. I went up there and I just shared three minute of a story of myself, you know, and so we just kind of rotated that. And so we had players share stories about childhood, 18th year birthday. And so it was kind of a cool time to just be a little bit vulnerable and just kind of share a little bit about yourself. That's one thing, you know, we've kind of done we've done little like fun activities whether it's like a five minute like connection thing just to like, you know, loose out. But I also feel like in especially at this level, we tend to be so tactical. And sometimes you just need like a fun day of just play, flying changes, 4v4s, like just play, like get back to just enjoying the game and not being coached so much. So, it's a mixture of onfield stuff, it's a mixture of off-field stuff, but those are a few things that, to kind of let people blow off steam and just more connect and, you know, in that regard.

Kent Hickey: Rob, just a quick followup to that. You know the comment the game is the best teacher kind of thing and I just was you know your background from France and Brazil do you feel like sometimes Americans are kind of overcoached in terms of it's all in the head and they're not as free will I mean this is kind of the a little bit of the wrap on American soccer for decades I don't know if it's still that way or not but they're sometimes too mechanical because they're not allowed the freedom to just be like in Brazil like, just go play you know what I'm saying or is that maybe, that's an unfair criticism at so.

Rob Birdsell: Well, I would just say I think in the American landscape is so vast and so diverse and you have even geographical regions that play very like you know teams in Southern California sometimes play very differently than a Midwest team, right? And I know I'm oversimplifying right? So, but yeah, I mean it's a tough balance because if you compare maybe to the Spanish player right where like there's a lot more from a young age, they
understand game intelligence more. There's also a culture in Europe of watching the game a lot. Like if you take a lot of, you know, our even national team players, you know, or youth national team players more specifically, I'm sure they watch the game because maybe their coaches influence them.
But how much of that culture, you know, sometimes you're more watching Friday Night Lights or Big 10 football, you know, than maybe actual soccer games. You know, there's nothing wrong with that. That's just culturally. So, I think sometimes just the understanding, but back to meeting players where they're at. It's like, let's say the game understanding isn't that well, you have to meet them. You have to meet them where they're at. And it's like I remember... I guess yeah, there's a few thoughts that come to mind, but one things I've had to learn is simplify, simplify, simplify, simplify... And the more I just simplify things and just now ask for higher execution, the better this team runs to to be perfectly honest.

Kent Hickey: Yeah, thank you.

Rob Birdsell: Continuing that sort of leadership development thread, Fabrice, as we've said, you spent your whole career developing players at the youth level before moving to professional coaching. What's the most important thing young leaders, whether they be athletes, educators, what do young people... What do they need to hear that they often don't hear?

Fabrice Gautrat: I mean, I think of two things: I think of first and foremost like your craft and your coaching ability. So when in this regard, you know, your is teaching ability, right? So, you know, I've read a lot of like one of Doug Lamont's books, one of my favorite books, the guide to coaching or the guide to and it's like, it's written for really actually specifically soccer coaches. But how how good are you at articulating concisely clearly the game or in your in maybe it's a subject matter whatever it is and how do you do it where you inspire the individual to take action. So that that is you can unpack that in so many ways. It's not just the actual information. It's actually how are you inspiring movement and action and taking people to a higher level. That's the first piece. The second piece is coachability. If you're not coachable and if you're not open to learning and feedback, you're going to stagnate and you're going to be limited to your impact and ultimately it's going to limit your coaching ability. So, I think those are two things that really come to mind is coaching ability, are you fine-tuning your craft all the time, right? And you can unpack that however you want. And then your coachableness, right, is really, really important.

Kent Hickey: Yeah. related to that: One of the areas that Rob and I really work a lot on in our organization is Catholic school leadership, right? At formation and because it's a really hard job and you're in a really really hard job as well. I mean, the expectations that you have and so perhaps, a given leader might be focused more on just himself or herself. While there is a responsibility for the formation of the next generation of leaders, right? And so, now you're I mean, you're in this top position in in really US soccer around the country. And so, I you know, so well, you've made it, right? How about those that are coming up behind you? What can you do to help them be formed as leaders? Not really talking about the, you know, the X's and O's here, right? Tactical and such, but more the characteristics of leadership that you you would like to see them be instilled within them.

Fabrice Gautrat: Yeah, I would I would first say the position that I currently hold is for rent, you know, and rent's due every day. I never for one second think I've arrived, you know, and I always maybe it's this chip on the shoulder, whatever it is, but every day I've got to, you know, prove it and however you want to look at it. So, I just want to say that. The second piece is and this has been an area of growth to your point. Sometimes I'm so focused and as a youth coach sometimes you're so focused on just your team and your individual. So you're always you never have a staff around you, right? So that's one of the things I've had to learn and grow and how do I lead and manage staff around me, right? So I currently have a couple assistants on staff that want to be head coaches one day, right? So like how am I growing them, inspiring them? And so, you know, we brought a technical
director in Twilight who's been fantastic in terms of her leadership and I've learned so much and she's helped me in some of the gaps that I've had in terms of those areas. But like even this past weekend, we were able to kind of tag team individual coaches, right, and just like help them grow like in terms of their IDP plan. So,  I think it's a really important part and it's, you know, if you're only focused on self and your own growth, which is, you know, yeah, it's not necessarily a bad thing. That's really important. But I think it also just makes it far more meaningful, you know, when you can help others kind of grow and lead. The next step would be how do I impact more around? And I think for me it's before I do that, I want to make sure my house is in order. You know, I want to make sure that inside these four walls like I'm doing the best job that I can. That's always my mentality because I'm still, you know, a young coach per se like in terms of just overall head coach. So, but I think hopefully as I, you know, as we improve and that processes are in place, I can expand more and have more of an outreach.

Kent Hickey: Yeah. You know, the comment you made about, you know, I love it. You rent, it's a rent position right now. I'm, my role at ILEE, I report to Rob, who's the executive director, and and I feel very much that way, by the way. I just want to let you know that often times my conversation with Rob to start a day, Rob will start the conversation with, you know, I don't I've decided not to fire you today. So, that's often how I actually start my day. So, I This isn't about me, though. Rob, what questions do you.

Rob Birdsell: I'd like to stick on that that leadership development. Uh, can you take Kent on your team as as your assistant and freely of him? No. But in serious.

Kent Hickey: That would not go very well.

Rob Birdsell: If you were designing a leadership formation program for young coaches or young educators, young school leaders, what would the first module be? What's the  beginning of the playbook?

 

Fabrice Gautrat: Honestly, this the more I'm in this is know thyself, like self-awareness. Self-awareness. The more I'm in this business, it's like we can talk about all these other things, but like how self-aware are we? Because if you don't know your gaps, you can't grow. You know, you don't know in which areas to grow. So, that would be it could be a simple, you know, self-starting conversations. It could be partner up with a mentor. It could be, you know, analyze your your past year. Whatever it is, but self-awareness would be number one.

Rob Birdsell: I totally agree. That is...

Kent Hickey: Well, we'll bring in St. Reso Vavala, a Spanish saint that we read a lot Fabrice, in our seminars, but she says that the goal... That the goal of life is just two things, self-nowledge and humility. And she doesn't place one in front of the other. I think she like her teaching is if you know yourself really well, you're probably going to be humble, and only through humility can you know yourself well. And so there's some great lessons, you know, that is within that. Rob, I just I just have one more question. I and again it's a little bit off from the side a little bit here Fabrice, but I was going back I just was thinking of something that you said which that you've said so many wonderful things. There was a movie a number of years ago. I think Matthew McConna was in it. I think it was it's called U505 if I have it right. But anyway, Matthew McConna was the number two guy in a submarine, right? And so he was the buddies with all the other sailors, right? Because he's the number two guy and he didn't really understand what it be the number one guy. And spoiler alert, of course, the captain dies. And so he's thrust into the role of being the number one guy and having to make hard decisions that costs lives, right? And so, not to say that, you know, exact equivalent here, but when you moved into this role that's the number
one role, particularly in the te setting that you're in, which is very very high profile. I mean, the great thing about women's soccer is just how high how how profile it is across the country, you know? It's it's amazing, right? So, you're in this very high-profile thing. What didn't you know before you moved into the role as the as the top guy? And that you learned... I see you smiling a little bit there.

Fabrice Gautrat: I hope I could spend hours on this question. I really could. I would say, probably going back to the self-awareness piece, right? like you can think you're very self-aware, but then when you're put in a different environment, there's gaps that you're not aware of, right? That kind of come up. And so, I think first and foremost is, you know, communication as a whole, like how was I communicating? And I think sometimes perception in reality or perception and intent, right? So, my intent of communicating one way could be perceived very differently to what I intended originally. And so, I have to think about my tone and how I communicate. And so I think communication and I could I could unpack that for days, but how was I communicating? Was I communicating a we mentality, right? Like how was I involving everyone in decision? So even now like we have I call it leadership huddles with our leadership group. So like you know the four or five leaders within our team will huddle up like every week just connect like wins works forecast like just simple things but just keeping the touch point you know because the more you separate the more things can kind of you know people can come up with different ideas and like oh what's happening here you know and like kind of make up things potentially. So I think the more you can communicate and  how you communicate has been one of the biggest things I've done.

Kent Hickey: Yeah, when those voids are there in communication, the gap's going to get filled somehow, you know, and not always in great ways, right? All of a sudden now the narrative changes and didn't even see that coming. So, yeah, thanks for that.

 

Rob Birdsell: Fabrice, we're going to close it out here with uh three rapidfire questions that are kind of fun for our listeners. So, the first best leadership book you have ever read.

Fabrice Gautrat: Man, there's a lot. There's a lot. Um...

Rob Birdsell: Think about the people we talked about today, future leaders, future coaches. What's something that they should be reading for an aspiring leader?

Fabrice Gautrat: Yeah. So, I would say  from a spiritual standpoint, spiritual leadership by Jalt Sanders, that was gamechanging book that I've read. When it comes to... Man I think of a few extreme Ownership you know by Joo Willick like I think that as simple as that sounds but like you know something's you know it's I think he has a quote something along the lines is pretty much like bad teams are a result of bad leaders. That's literally what you know he talks about. And I think it's always pointing at yourself and like how do you need to grow and learn? And I think that that's a book I would say it's pretty foundational in terms of that. I would say if you want to really hone in on your craft, The Guide to Coaching by Douglav is very good when it comes to that. So, sorry I gave you like three, but anyways.

Rob Birdsell: Oh, and the one Douglav I think would really translate to teaching. What's something speaking of a teacher, a great teacher and a great coach always have in common?

Fabrice Gautrat: I think I'd go back to the two things I said about, coaching ability and coachable, right? So I think how how well do you teach and not only like you teach but how how well do people not only take in the information, but are inspired by the information you know and actually you know how can you take I remember I had a US history professor that just made it very exciting like he just found a way to just make it very exciting and I wasn't a big history guy at all but I was like at least like I felt like I was learning something this was exciting you know so... Yeah and the ability to be coachable like you you have to consist constantly uh seek feedback you know from from different stakeholders around you.

Rob Birdsell: Great. And our final question we ask every guest on the podcast. Who was your greatest teacher and why?

Fabrice Gautrat: I had two. So one was in college. What I liked about this teacher is he never... He didn't want you to think like the masses. He wanted you to really understand and understand why do you believe what you believe. Don't just believe something because your parents told you. Don't just believe something because your institution told you. Like why do you believe what you believe? And I just always remember him saying that and he had this one line that always resonated me. Readers are leaders. leaders are readers. Like he would always repeat that constantly.

Kent Hickey: Great line.

Fabrice Gautrat:  So I would I would say that one. And then a personal just other coach, he's actually in Southern California. His name's Estabbon, but he really taught me how to coach and I would say even coach on the women's side really well. Like a lot of my philosophies and how I coach have really kind of stemmed from just watching him daily back then.

Rob Birdsell: That's great. Well, Fabrice, thank you for taking time out of your preseason. I hope you and the Dash have a great season. I think you're going to get some some new Houston Dash fans out of this podcast.

Kent Hickey: Yeah, you bet.

Rob Birdsell: And, just appreciate the time.

Kent Hickey:  When do you guys come up to play here in Seattle? Are you coming up here? What's going on?

Fabrice Gautrat: Oh gosh, we are. Do you know the date? We'll pull that up for you in a sec.

Kent Hickey: Well, no. I'll look it up myself, but head off for that.

Fabrice Gautrat: We do play up there. Um...

Kent Hickey: Oh, yeah. All right. Well, I'll get a I'll get my Houston jersey. I don't have it yet. I'll have my Houston jersey on. It Do they come in XXX size? Because I got to find one, but, okay.

Fabrice Gautrat: August 30th. August 30th.

Kent Hickey: All right. Okay. I'm gonna mark it on the calendar.

Rob Birdsell: And also, and the Chicago Stars at the new stadium at the lakefront, Fabrice.

Fabrice Gautrat: That'll be exciting. We're going to play, I think, in October. So, I'm sure that'll be a win matchup.

Rob Birdsell:  I looked at it. I think unfortunately we have a conflict.

Kent Hickey: Clearly a wonderful coach. The best coaches are the best people, right? They're just  really really caring and thoughtful people. What a blessing you are. Fabrice and what a blessing it was for us to have you on. Thank you so much.

Fabrice Gautrat: Well, I appreciate the time. I loved the question. Sometimes you don't get asked these questions and really reflect kind of on leadership. So, it's it's been a time to just yeah, take away from the busyiness of everything and I I really appreciate the dialogue. So...

 

 

Rob Birdsell:  That was great. Wow, Kent, that was uh that was a lot of fun.

Kent Hickey:  It was really good. And I just feel like there were so many, so many areas that Fabrice got into in terms of leadership that it's going to take a little while to distill it, right? But I noticed that we didn't spend a lot of time talking about his resume or results and such and rather we talked more about the personal qualities that he has and then he's and as you mentioned his his commitment to growth, his own personal growth as just a key to to his success. Really impressive person. I'm sure he's a really impressive coach as well.

Rob Birdsell:  Yeah. Amazing. As I said at the beginning, one of the best. I also was struck by the readers are leaders, leaders are readers. And the number of books he was just piping off like that. It's clear that he is somebody open to growth and yearning to grow. As as a leader, as a person, and I didn't write it down, what was that thing right at the beginning? What you got to bring to the job? Outstanding value or...

Kent Hickey: Oh outrageous value.

Rob Birdsell: Outrageous.

Kent Hickey: Outrageous value and and related to that a culture of destination and I assume they're intertwined with each other. Yeah, I love that phrase outrageous value. So what's a if it's given schools, you know, it's open house and you're the head of the school and you have to give a talk. What's your outrageous value that you bring? And your outrageous value might be, we are so centered on the person. We are so centered on care.
We leave believe every child is made in the image of God. Whatever it might be, but you but those are outrageous statements, right? Because they're outrageous values. And that's what he premises his whole leadership approach on. He creates a culture of destination because of his emphasis on outrageous values. Great stuff.

Rob Birdsell: I think we should adopt the Houston Dash this year. As our team and let's I mean just fun to follow and watch what happens.

Kent Hickey:  Let's do this. And just again, think of the swag potential for us, Rob, if we were to do that. Let's get a hold of their marketing department. And we're all in... We're all in on the Houston Dash. So...

Rob Birdsell: We are. So, to our listeners, once again, thank you for joining us, and we hope that you enjoyed this conversation with Fabrice, transferring leadership lessons from the pitch to the classroom. Like us on social media and share this with your friends. We'll see you on the next class.

Kent Hickey: Thank you.